Cool, as you said we basically agree so we're arguing semantics and relatively minor things.


At decent RRs Thanes can get over 80% layered defenses, a tad more with the CL 11% Evade buff, and VWs basically can reach slightly over 60% when all is said and done. (Incl. Greater Evade Myth on top of cap Parry from MoP!) So you can turtle-up significantly better on a Thane, and with the 34 Sword style you can still do decent 1h damage between the melee damage, DD proc, and DA. Then add the 2 instas which the VW can only match with a very silly DoT, and you can definitely hang better in a longer melee bout then the VW can...provided ofc that you don't get yourself side/rear stunned and gibbed.

The best weapon the VW has in a straight up slugging match is the Slash debuff style (off Parry) which can then boost his anytime damage a good bit, but still he has to face being 19% ASRed the entire fight, and thus eating about 2x 1h melee rounds for every 2h attack he makes, and that with ~25% less defense then the Thane has.

As you said though, this certainly implies a more melee oriented decent RR Thane, but my point is that Thane's are actually pretty nicely equipped to handle VWs, even if the outright melee DPS of the VW is certainly significantly stronger. However, being able to stand up to VWs in 1v1 is not something a lot of other melee classes can claim, because many of them suffer from being easily Root kited if they can't just be straight up meleed down by the VW.

I agree though, I think both are pretty nice classes in their own right for solo and grouped play, but they're a tad harder to temp & play then your average class.

Both also have valid issues I'm sure as neither are particularly popular, but I'm just not convinced at all that Thane's issues have anything to do with their melee or nuking capabilities.

 

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Even I dont think they need a lot. 3 or 4 simple, situational, things.


#1 on my list is the Skald Endo redux group buff moved to thane. Like Champs and Friars.

#2 on my list is a spec 10% pierce buff similar to Heretic, at about +/- 49 Stormcalling.

#3 on my list is a better r5, some sort of defense or damamge+return like Reaver r5.

#4 on my list is something like lower tank passives, 10% magic and/or 15% stoicism.


If not these then something more class defining.


Nothing really game changing, just something to make thanes more versitile.

 

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free lighting mounts for all thanes,


best fix there is

 

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.

 

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1) 2.2 spec point for thane
2) Weaponskill put on line with reavers
3) Spell pierce buff and endo redux buff


will alleviate some issues with thanes.


as far as valewalker vs thane, putting both at equal range, valewalker should win the cast battle because they have 2 ranged insta interupts vs the thane's 1. doomhammer and valewalker throw weapon cancel each other out, the thane's rr5 is on a 10 minute reuse timer also. i would prefer to group a valewalker than a thane because of disease and the frontal aoe snare that has no immunity.

 

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wish thanes got some nuke+heal or nuke+debuff or nuke+lifetap.

Would help the survivability or their group utility.

 

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Not gonna lie, quit reading when I saw the post about VW's not having group utility...

 

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VWs aren't a good group class. Most of the people i play with consider VWs as barely more group-friendly than maulers or stealthers and i agree with that opinion: they're a sub-par BG(stunning is not enough, occasional disease can't make up for snares), and a bad frontline class(inadequate instant-spells).

The only good configuration a VW might fit well into, would be a tank group.

This is unequivocally false, VW get casted disease, BG, very nice Melee DPS, ranged interupts, nice ranged DPS, a bit of group healing even, a nice RR5 that effects the whole group, ichor.

In fact, VW is one of the most dynamic classes in the game. I would argue they are a necessity in any hib group...

 

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lol, /popcorn

 

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