| Author |
Topic:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale [Locked] |
vn_nnanji  Title: Outpost Music Expert
Posts: 1,964
Registered: 2001-6-30 17:22:56
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:00am
Subject:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale |
Cawlin posted:
Taliesihne posted:
Cawlin posted:
Right, but soccer is somewhat interesting in that as you go UP the ladder of skill and "professionalism", the amount of "contact" goes down.
It's the exact opposite actually.
Really?
I played in high school and it was half a brawl more than half the time. The coaches kept telling us that we weren't going to be able to get by with all physical play if we intended to go on and play at the college level. They made a point to talk about how the game was more about finesse, speed, and talent at the higher levels rather than brute force and physical play...
Now if we could only find a sport that was about both........................
-----signature-----
|
Cawlin Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:01am
Subject:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale |
Taliesihne posted:
Ya, really.
Things are much more physical, but they are much much better at it. They are also better about hiding it.
I think what your coach was driving at was that you wouldn't be able to overpower people physically like you were used to doing. And that has everything to do with the Talent on the field.
But make no mistakes, John Terry is not a cream puff. He can and will put your d#$% in the dirt - it's what he gets paid to do.
Um, John Terry isn't going to hit anyone any harder than any other 175 lb guy. He may be more willing to do it, but then the way fouls get called in European soccer... yeah... I think you know where I'm going here.
There's no particular inherent "danger" factor from getting hit that will be encountered stepping up from whatever the league is below the Premiere League into the Premiere League like there is by whatever relative comparison there would be to "minor league" NFL teams vs. the pros. The speed and strength of the pro NFL players is frankly super-human. They are bigger, faster, and stronger, and their LEGITIMATE job is to hit other PLAYERS.
-----signature-----
If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
Everyone playing WoW knows everything about playing two classes: 1) their own and 2) Hunters
|
Cawlin Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:01am
Subject:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale |
vn_nnanji posted:
Cawlin posted:
Right, but soccer is somewhat interesting in that as you go UP the ladder of skill and "professionalism", the amount of "contact" goes down.
Now if we could only find a sport that was about both........................
That was kind of the point of the comparison that I was making...
-----signature-----
If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
Everyone playing WoW knows everything about playing two classes: 1) their own and 2) Hunters
|
Yukishiro1 Posts: 3,243
Registered: 2002-9-20 23:52:57
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:01am
Subject:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale |
vn_nnanji posted:
They are thinking that a new coach makes a world of difference. I suspect a new coach in Soccer means very little
Why continue to make yourself look dumb speculating about things you don't know anything about and manage to get consistently wrong?
Relegation leads to stale games because the bottom teams have little to play for, particularly in the second half of the season. When you throw in a system that actually rewards you for sucking more than everyone else it creates bad incentives that manifest themselves in the games. These are just facts.
This really isn't about futbol vs football. The MLS is set up along the lines of other U.S. sports and it leads to stale games too.
|
Taliesihne Title: Wind on the Deep Waters
Posts: 1,117
Registered: 2004-2-19 04:47:59
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:01am
Subject:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale |
Cawlin posted:
Um, John Terry isn't going to hit anyone any harder than any other 175 lb guy.
That's like saying Manny Pacquio doesn't hit harder then any other 115 pound guy.
Cawlin posted:
He may be more willing to do it, but then the way fouls get called in European soccer... yeah... I think you know where I'm going here.
They let quite a bit go in the EPL that would frankly result in instant ejections in lesser leagues.
Cawlin posted:
There's no particular inherent "danger" factor from getting hit that will be encountered stepping up from whatever the league is below the Premiere League into the Premiere League like there is by whatever relative comparison there would be to "minor league" NFL teams vs. the pros. The speed and strength of the pro NFL players is frankly super-human. They are bigger, faster, and stronger, and their LEGITIMATE job is to hit other PLAYERS.
I think your bias towards the sport is doing your intellect an injustice here.
People like Mr. Terry are super-human. And you do risk serious injury putting rank amateurs on a professional pitch with the best players the world.
I'm not even taking sides here on which is worse - I'm simply saying that the axioms that hold true on the NFL also hold true for European Football. Players are bigger, more skilled, tougher and a hell of a lot more talented. Were my local adult team to get put on the pitch with Chelsea, most of us would leave on a stretcher.
-----signature-----
Jesus saves, Allah protects, and Cthulhu thinks you'd make a nice sandwich
First comes smiles, then lies. Last is gunfire. -Roland Deschain, of Gilead
|
Szerek  Posts: 338
Registered: 2000-8-8 09:26:09
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:01am
Subject:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale |
I don't think the NBA would be a good candidate. Does anyone watch the NBA anymore? I stopped watching it when it stopped being a finesse game they started working toward the WWE format we have now.
I would think Hockey would be a better candidate on North America if you incorporated Canada.
Ironically, I've started really getting into hockey for the first time. The only problem is, I can't find much here on TV. 
-----signature-----
"The reason they call it the American Dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it."
"The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions."
- George Carlin
|
Cawlin Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:01am
Subject:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale |
Taliesihne posted:
Cawlin posted:
Um, John Terry isn't going to hit anyone any harder than any other 175 lb guy.
That's like saying Manny Pacquio doesn't hit harder then any other 115 pound guy.
Talk about an apples to oranges comparison.
Taliesihne posted:
Cawlin posted:
He may be more willing to do it, but then the way fouls get called in European soccer... yeah... I think you know where I'm going here.
They let quite a bit go in the EPL that would frankly result in instant ejections in lesser leagues.
If you say so... seems dubious though to me.
Taliesihne posted:
Cawlin posted:
There's no particular inherent "danger" factor from getting hit that will be encountered stepping up from whatever the league is below the Premiere League into the Premiere League like there is by whatever relative comparison there would be to "minor league" NFL teams vs. the pros. The speed and strength of the pro NFL players is frankly super-human. They are bigger, faster, and stronger, and their LEGITIMATE job is to hit other PLAYERS.
I think your bias towards the sport is doing your intellect an injustice here.
People like Mr. Terry are super-human. And you do risk serious injury putting rank amateurs on a professional pitch with the best players the world.
I'm not even taking sides here on which is worse - I'm simply saying that the axioms that hold true on the NFL also hold true for European Football. Players are bigger, more skilled, tougher and a hell of a lot more talented. Were my local adult team to get put on the pitch with Chelsea, most of us would leave on a stretcher.
Dude, the Philadelphia Eagles used to have training camp at West Chester University. I grew up about 15 miles from there. You could get to see some of those training camp practices as a member of the public. I have stood within a few yards of of these guys and have watched them move their tremendous bulk at speeds that were frankly grotesque and hit other players with force that was monstrous.
I have watched Penn State's football team practice in person as well. There is no comparison. See, there would be maybe two or three guys or maybe up to a half dozen guys on a D-1 football squad that had any potential in the NFL - meanwhile the ENTIRE NFL roster is made up of guys that are better, bigger, faster, stronger, than those few guys on a college squad. The WORST guy on the NFL team is as good or better than the best guy on the D-1 squad. That's the difference between "pro" and "minor league" football in America. If you put an NFL team up against a D-1 college team, and told them both to play all out... it would be ugly... UGLY.
As for your team against Chelsea, you guys might be leaving on stretchers, but you'd be doing so out of dehydration and cramping. No reason for the Chelsea guys to hit you guys, they'd just run around and past you until you fell over trying to keep up lol (and that is certainly not meant to be a dig against you or your team).
Soccer isn't about hitting people, yes some contact happens, but that's not the nature of the game. Football is about hitting people (and of course so is boxing).
-----signature-----
If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
Everyone playing WoW knows everything about playing two classes: 1) their own and 2) Hunters
|
Taliesihne Title: Wind on the Deep Waters
Posts: 1,117
Registered: 2004-2-19 04:47:59
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:01am
Subject:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale |
Cawlin posted:
Talk about an apples to oranges comparison.
Not really. Terry is an enforcer.
Cawlin posted:
If you say so... seems dubious though to me.
Not really. Pretty normal actually. Professionals get more latitude when it comes to physicality then us mere mortals. This is true in every sport.
Cawlin posted:
Dude, the Philadelphia Eagles used to have training camp at West Chester University. I grew up about 15 miles from there. You could get to see some of those training camp practices as a member of the public. I have stood within a few yards of of these guys and have watched them move their tremendous bulk at speeds that were frankly grotesque and hit other players with force that was monstrous.
I have watched Penn State's football team practice in person as well. There is no comparison. See, there would be maybe two or three guys or maybe up to a half dozen guys on a D-1 football squad that had any potential in the NFL - meanwhile the ENTIRE NFL roster is made up of guys that are better, bigger, faster, stronger, than those few guys on a college squad. The WORST guy on the NFL team is as good or better than the best guy on the D-1 squad. That's the difference between "pro" and "minor league" football in America. If you put an NFL team up against a D-1 college team, and told them both to play all out... it would be ugly... UGLY.
So your argument is that pro-football players are super-human because you've seen them and soccer player aren't because you haven't?
Terry is superhuman when compared to your average soccer player just like Ray Lewis is superhuman when compared to your average middle linebacker.
Cawlin posted:
As for your team against Chelsea, you guys might be leaving on stretchers, but you'd be doing so out of dehydration and cramping. No reason for the Chelsea guys to hit you guys, they'd just run around and past you until you fell over trying to keep up lol (and that is certainly not meant to be a dig against you or your team).
Soccer isn't about hitting people, yes some contact happens, but that's not the nature of the game. Football is about hitting people (and of course so is boxing).
Big surprise, they are different sports.
Top physical conditioning is a huge part of toughness btw.
Again, I'm not saying that Football players are weaker\Soccer players are stronger, I'm simply pointing out that the axiom we started on holds true for soccer. Pro Soccer players are in incredible shape and incredibly tough when compared to the rest of their sport. Putting an unprepared team on the pitch with them is a recipe for injury.
-----signature-----
Jesus saves, Allah protects, and Cthulhu thinks you'd make a nice sandwich
First comes smiles, then lies. Last is gunfire. -Roland Deschain, of Gilead
|
Cawlin Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:01am
Subject:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale |
Taliesihne posted:
Again, I'm not saying that Football players are weaker\Soccer players are stronger, I'm simply pointing out that the axiom we started on holds true for soccer. Pro Soccer players are in incredible shape and incredibly tough when compared to the rest of their sport. Putting an unprepared team on the pitch with them is a recipe for injury.
Unprepared is one thing.
Making the comparison of your adult rec league team to Chelsea is about an "unprepared" team going against a pro team.
Putting Penn State (a very well prepared team) against the Pittsburgh Steelers (a very well prepared team) would be dangerous to most of the players on Penn State's team. They simply aren't big enough or strong enough to stand up to the punishment that the Steelers entire team could dish out.
Meanwhile, put Penn State's D-1 soccer team (well prepared) against Chelsea (well prepared) and you're looking at nowhere near the same disparity in size/strength/speed nor danger to Penn State's soccer players. You'll see a huge disparity in talent, yes, but not in physical fitness and preparedness.
-----signature-----
If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
Everyone playing WoW knows everything about playing two classes: 1) their own and 2) Hunters
|
Taliesihne Title: Wind on the Deep Waters
Posts: 1,117
Registered: 2004-2-19 04:47:59
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:01am
Subject:
Not having relegation makes American sports stale |
Penn State would go home in stretchers as well.
The disparity is just as stark in soccer as it is in football. Not so sure what's so hard to grasp about this.
-----signature-----
Jesus saves, Allah protects, and Cthulhu thinks you'd make a nice sandwich
First comes smiles, then lies. Last is gunfire. -Roland Deschain, of Gilead
|
|
