| Author |
Topic:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun [Locked] |
|
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:03am
Subject:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun |
Cawlin posted:
sweeny_comodore posted:
Cawlin posted:
sweeny_comodore posted:
and that was a total troll because nobody had any information about anything other than cops killed a kid for holding a pellet gun in school
apparently it worked because it clearly made a couple of you stop and think about your position on murdering a dumb kid.
That's not true at all. Everyone who read the actual article had corroborating testimony that the police asked the kid to put down the weapon and he did not. Everyone who read the article saw the gun the kid was holding and realized that it was for all intents and purposes indistinguishable from a lethal handgun in that situation. Most of us just read the story and went with the facts that were given.
You are not rational when it comes to cops dude, nnanji is right about that.
make up whatever excuses you want to justify your blood lust.
the original article gave no indications of the kids attitude with the gun, how long was waited between telling him to drop it and shooting, what lead up to the incident.
the only thing the original article said was a kid in the hall with a gun that turned out to be a pellet gun.
are you also in agreement that death for this kid was the ONLY answer and a beanbag/tazer should not even have been bothered to be tried first?
should cops just ditch their arsenal of nonlethal weapons or keep them around for use on criples, retards, and old women in place of a slap in the face?
Lol you're either trolling again or have gone off the deep end here. In either case, it's not worth trying to make you understand. You hate cops, we all get it. You think that all cops are murdering jack-booted thugs, we all get it. Bottom line though is that the kid pointed a gun at cops, was ordered to drop it, didn't, and was shot because of it. In truth, the kid got a great deal more leeway than an adult in a similar situation would have gotten.
If you get pulled over by a cop for a traffic stop and get out of your car holding a gun, the cop isn't going to wait for you to point it at him and then try to talk you down, nor should he.
i would expect to be tazed almost before the door is finished opening and my foot is on the ground.
if you think otherwise then you are just a moron and a bad troll.
-----signature-----
Jesus? No, but there is indeed a god shaped hole in the heart of man, why is yours so empty? -- snarf igraine
the original monotheism: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phallus
|
Cawlin  Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:03am
Subject:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun |
reesescups posted:
Cawlin posted:
reesescups posted:
This is what I was trying to turn the discussion to before Metalface shot his load of stupid all over the place...
Yeah - I can understand what happened, why it happened, etc etc - case closed.
But seriously in retrospect, why do we accept this, why do we tolerate it, why is this not only acceptable in our society but expected? This says something very disturbing about our society...
A metal detector that students pass through would have likely alleviated this situation. That tactic is being employed in a lot of schools nowadays. There's also the zero tolerance policy that has schools expelling kids who bite their pizza into an "L" shape and hold the crust like a gun...
Good points - but I was more referring about how our police react...
Well, take into account the fact that this town is a pretty crime laden sihthole in Texas. I'm betting gang violence there is not exactly unheard of.
Setting that aside, consider previous incidents involving school violence and criticisms and catch-22 situations law enforcement officers were placed in over them.
Just try, for 5 minutes to put yourself into the shoes of a cop, with a family and likely kids of their own, doing their job - that they've sworn to do - protect and serve the community - and how you might react when some kid holds up a gun and points it at you or your partner. Think about whether you're willing to gamble on seeing your wife and kids or if you're willing to gamble on your partner seeing his wife and kids at the end of the day.
Think about the other kids in the classrooms and your duty to protect them and how you'd feel telling their parents that you didn't want to shoot the 15 year old kid who was threatening everyone with a gun until he'd already shot your partner and a teacher and another 2 kids, killing one and turning the other into a vegetable...
-----signature-----
If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
Everyone playing WoW knows everything about playing two classes: 1) their own and 2) Hunters
|
Cawlin Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:03am
Subject:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun |
sweeny_comodore posted:
Cawlin posted:
If you get pulled over by a cop for a traffic stop and get out of your car holding a gun, the cop isn't going to wait for you to point it at him and then try to talk you down, nor should he.
i would expect to be tazed almost before the door is finished opening and my foot is on the ground.
if you think otherwise then you are just a moron and a bad troll.
Then you would be sadly mistaken. If you pull a gun on a cop, 9 times out of 10, you're getting shot, period. That's because at that point, it's either you or him and he's been informed about the dozens or even hundreds of officers that get shot that way every year.
We pay police to protect us and to serve us. We do not pay them to foolishly forfeit their lives to insulate you from your own stupidity.
-----signature-----
If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
Everyone playing WoW knows everything about playing two classes: 1) their own and 2) Hunters
|
|
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:03am
Subject:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun |
moron
the cop would have a tazer on me before i even got out of the car with or without a gun
as taze happy as cops are now adays there would never be a "me or him" minute because id be on the ground with electrodes in my chest before the door was even open.
-----signature-----
Jesus? No, but there is indeed a god shaped hole in the heart of man, why is yours so empty? -- snarf igraine
the original monotheism: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phallus |
Cawlin Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:03am
Subject:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun |
sweeny_comodore posted:
lerdl lerdl lerdl lerdl lerdl
You're a drooling monkey over this dude.
-----signature-----
If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
Everyone playing WoW knows everything about playing two classes: 1) their own and 2) Hunters
|
reesescups Title: //Captain America
Posts: 2,537
Registered: 2003-5-26 14:45:53
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:03am
Subject:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun |
Cawlin posted:
Well, take into account the fact that this town is a pretty crime laden sihthole in Texas.
Ok - my bad - shot first ask question later, or not ask questions... Less Texans is always a good thing 
Cawlin posted:
I'm betting gang violence there is not exactly unheard of.
Setting that aside, consider previous incidents involving school violence and criticisms and catch-22 situations law enforcement officers were placed in over them.
Just try, for 5 minutes to put yourself into the shoes of a cop, with a family and likely kids of their own, doing their job - that they've sworn to do - protect and serve the community - and how you might react when some kid holds up a gun and points it at you or your partner. Think about whether you're willing to gamble on seeing your wife and kids or if you're willing to gamble on your partner seeing his wife and kids at the end of the day.
Think about the other kids in the classrooms and your duty to protect them and how you'd feel telling their parents that you didn't want to shoot the 15 year old kid who was threatening everyone with a gun until he'd already shot your partner and a teacher and another 2 kids, killing one and turning the other into a vegetable...
I put a lot more than 5 minutes into thinking about this. And as far as this situation goes - sure fine, he did what he did and personally - case closed (unless other testimony comes forward).
But you seem to be dwelling on the side of the cop here. and think for a minute about what you are saying. Keep in mind that a cop puts his life on the line every time he puts on the uniform or puts himself in action as a law enforcement agent. That is his job. That being said gambling on seeing your wife at the end of the day is what they did when they signed on to be in law enforcement. Using that as justification for killing someone doesn't cut the mustard. Using that justification a cop can kill anyone, anywhere at anytime...
IMO it is clear that this cop did NOT protect the children - he shot one of them. Yes, for a justifiable reason, but he shot and killed one of the people he is supposed to be protecting. The cop was the rational, professional, adult in this situation and *could have handled the situation differently. Killing someone should always be the last, not first, resort - especially when dealing with a child around other children. It's not like this kid just got done with a shooting rampage and already took out 20 people or something...
-----signature-----
"man up, you wimp." - Groucho48
"I'm not racist at all." - dae_trist
|
Koneg  Title: Evil Genius
Posts: 894
Registered: 2001-12-4 15:31:28
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:03am
Subject:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun |
sweeny_comodore posted:
there is no reason they could not have shot first with the bean bag
Yea except for the whole holding a gun thing. 
Using less-than-lethal weapons when a lethal weapon is called for is a good way to get dead.
-----signature-----
* First rule of a gun fight: Have a gun.
|
"Any sufficiently advanced idiocy is
indistinguishable from trolling." -- Arthur C Clarke
|
Sin_of_Onin Posts: 1,307
Registered: 2005-6-29 08:21:12
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:03am
Subject:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun |
Was the kid in any position to hurt other kids or other adults (besides the cops)? From what I read it sounded like he was already isolated.
The cop's job is first to protect everyone else, after that it is about defusing the situation. Shooting the kid is a very clear indication they failed.
-----signature-----
"Okay... I'm with you fellas" --Delmar
F is for Fake-believe
"We apologise for the inconvenience" --God
"What Jesus fails to appreciate is that it's the meek who are the problem"--Reg
Run, Forrest! Run!
|
Cawlin Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:03am
Subject:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun |
reesescups posted:
Cawlin posted:
Well, take into account the fact that this town is a pretty crime laden sihthole in Texas.
Ok - my bad - shot first ask question later, or not ask questions... Less Texans is always a good thing
Cawlin posted:
I'm betting gang violence there is not exactly unheard of.
Setting that aside, consider previous incidents involving school violence and criticisms and catch-22 situations law enforcement officers were placed in over them.
Just try, for 5 minutes to put yourself into the shoes of a cop, with a family and likely kids of their own, doing their job - that they've sworn to do - protect and serve the community - and how you might react when some kid holds up a gun and points it at you or your partner. Think about whether you're willing to gamble on seeing your wife and kids or if you're willing to gamble on your partner seeing his wife and kids at the end of the day.
Think about the other kids in the classrooms and your duty to protect them and how you'd feel telling their parents that you didn't want to shoot the 15 year old kid who was threatening everyone with a gun until he'd already shot your partner and a teacher and another 2 kids, killing one and turning the other into a vegetable...
I put a lot more than 5 minutes into thinking about this. And as far as this situation goes - sure fine, he did what he did and personally - case closed (unless other testimony comes forward).
But you seem to be dwelling on the side of the cop here. and think for a minute about what you are saying. Keep in mind that a cop puts his life on the line every time he puts on the uniform or puts himself in action as a law enforcement agent. That is his job. That being said gambling on seeing your wife at the end of the day is what they did when they signed on to be in law enforcement. Using that as justification for killing someone doesn't cut the mustard. Using that justification a cop can kill anyone, anywhere at anytime...
You are taking the argument out of the rational and applying black and white standards to it that simply don't apply. There were mitigating circumstances that made the officers justified in shooting here. Those circumstances were that the kid posed (for all intents and purposes) a clear and present danger to the other students and teachers in the school and to the officers themselves AND the kid would not comply with orders that would have diffused the situation - thereby indicating that he was either a greater danger due to his incoherence or a greater danger due to his willful disobedience of a direct order.
Before you get all whipped up on another tangent about that, I'm not saying that cops get to just order people to do anything they want, whenever they want, but they DO get to order people to put their fkn gun down, ESPECIALLY in a school.
reesescups posted:
IMO it is clear that this cop did NOT protect the children - he shot one of them. Yes, for a justifiable reason, but he shot and killed one of the people he is supposed to be protecting. The cop was the rational, professional, adult in this situation and *could have handled the situation differently. Killing someone should always be the last, not first, resort - especially when dealing with a child around other children. It's not like this kid just got done with a shooting rampage and already took out 20 people or something...
The cops protected the other children from what you or anyone else would have assumed was a violent criminal in the moment, and rightly so.
When swirly is pulled over for his 4th DUI and storms out of his car with his gun pulled and aims it at the cops, he ceases to be one of the citizens the cops are there to protect and serve, and becomes the violent criminal the cops are there to protect the other citizens (and themselves) from.
-----signature-----
If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
Everyone playing WoW knows everything about playing two classes: 1) their own and 2) Hunters
|
Koneg Title: Evil Genius
Posts: 894
Registered: 2001-12-4 15:31:28
|
Date Posted:
1/1/00 12:03am
Subject:
Texas police kill 8th-grader carrying pellet gun |
reesescups posted:
But seriously in retrospect, why do we accept this
Because we're not stupid?
Point a gun at me I'm going to shoot you as fast as I can... and I have no intention of waiting until you shoot me first. Asking the police to wait or try something stupid (like a bean bag) before they do the same?
Yea that's Big-R Retarded.
-----signature-----
* First rule of a gun fight: Have a gun.
|
"Any sufficiently advanced idiocy is
indistinguishable from trolling." -- Arthur C Clarke
|
|
