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Author Topic: The 7 Rules of Bureaucracy [Locked]
Yukishiro1  4 stars
Posts: 3,243
Registered: 2002-9-20 23:52:57
It's a stupid list. It describes nothing meaningful. None of it has anything to do with bereaucracy in particular as opposed to any other human creation.


The main way bureaucracy keeps itself alive is not any of those things but finding more and more ways to push paper. "Standardization" is the great rallying cry. Although in practice what it amounts to is really making sure each little task has its own seperate standard, so that you can't use the same paper each time.
Cawlin  4 stars
Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
Yukishiro1 posted:

It's a stupid list. It describes nothing meaningful. None of it has anything to do with bereaucracy in particular as opposed to any other human creation.

The main way bureaucracy keeps itself alive is not any of those things but finding more and more ways to push paper. "Standardization" is the great rallying cry. Although in practice what it amounts to is really making sure each little task has its own seperate standard, so that you can't use the same paper each time.



paulg_68 posted:

So the list is invalid because it includes things that are known to be true in other contexts?


 

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Yukishiro1  4 stars
Posts: 3,243
Registered: 2002-9-20 23:52:57
Title the list "the 7 rules of human life" and it's just as "true." Which is to say, not really true at all unless you're an angry little man.


It's a stupid list. I'm sorry you have trouble distinguishing between a bad attack and a good one.
Cawlin  4 stars
Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
Yukishiro1 posted:

I'm taking a page out of sobaki's playbook on this one because I've got nothing better.



Yeah, we know.

 

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If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
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Yukishiro1  4 stars
Posts: 3,243
Registered: 2002-9-20 23:52:57
I actually already told you in two sentences what the real way bureaucracies perpeuate themselves is. Which you ignored because you wanted to continue to whine and cry.


So it's a bit funny to see you whining and crrying about how I'm allegedly whining and crying.
Cawlin  4 stars
Posts: 1,759
Registered: 2005-2-22 07:58:42
Yukishiro1 posted:

I actually already told you in two sentences what the real way bureaucracies perpeuate themselves is. Which you ignored because you wanted to continue to whine and cry.

So it's a bit funny to see you whining and crrying about how I'm allegedly whining and crying.



And your two sentence "explanation" avoids answering exactly how bureaucracies continue to be allowed to find new ways to push paper - they do so by propagating a perceived need for their existence - through the mechanisms in the list in the OP.

 

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If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
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paulg_68  4 stars
Posts: 2,469
Registered: 2009-7-27 18:45:54
The list is very insightful. Knowing the mechanisms of bureaucracy allows us to guard against bureaucracy growing out of control.

A certain amount of government bureaucracy is necessary. The list is not an indictment of all government bureaucracy contrary to what some overly defensive people are trying to infer.

 

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Yukishiro1  4 stars
Posts: 3,243
Registered: 2002-9-20 23:52:57
Not really. Bureaucracies justify themselves with paper too. Some of those "rules" are not only not specific to bureaucracies but actively inaccurate. Bureaucracies spend a tremendous amount of time justifying their decisions to the public (although the public rarely bothers to actually read it). Whoever made that list has obviously never even bothered to open the Federal Register if he thinks Rule 2a is accurate at all.


Bureacracies survive based on public apathy, not based on some sinister plot. The average press release from a government department never gets read by anyone ever, so it doesn't have to be full of lies.
Yukishiro1  4 stars
Posts: 3,243
Registered: 2002-9-20 23:52:57
paulg_68 posted:

The list is very insightful. Knowing the mechanisms of bureaucracy allows us to guard against bureaucracy growing out of control.



Not only is it not insightful but it gets things totally backwards. The list makes bureaucracy seem like some sort of conspiracy. If you think thats accurate you're doomed because that isn't how bureaucracies are at all.


What makes bureacracies so hard to fix is inertia and apathy, not some conspiracy by bureaucrats. The list is just fundamentally wrong on what bureaucracies actually are and how they function.
paulg_68  4 stars
Posts: 2,469
Registered: 2009-7-27 18:45:54
Yukishiro1 posted:

Some of those "rules" are not only not specific to bureaucracies


Why do you keep bringing this up? It's like saying a human anatomy lesson shouldn't mention blood, bones, and muscles because other animals have those things too. Why do you think an explanation of how a thing works should only include things unique to the subject?

 

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If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch...
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"Most of the human wealth on earth exists between the ears of live human beings." - theredkay1

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