Ptilk posted:

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There are no good guys in this situation. There are evil bastards on both sides who don't want peace unless that peace comes in the exact form they wish. Neither side is more "moral" or more "right".

Blowing up buses with suicide bombers isn't any better, or worse, than firing missiles from gunships into crowded city centers. The aim of both actions is to intimidate and kill in order to get what you want. Neither action has any effect on the reaction to it, you can bomb city centers till hell freezes over and you are still going to get people willing to blow up buses, and vice versa.

What can be done is to insist on current international law being followed. That law represents our collective best effort at stopping such events from taking place.

What comes across to some as "Anti-Israel" is a generally a reaction to the fact that the US government heavily support, both financially and strategically, one side of this issue and ignores any times they violate that law.....while loudly condemning the Palestinian side when they violate that law. Pointing out the fact that it takes idiots and evil bastards on both sides to keep this decades long abomination of an occupation going isn't anti-anything...except anti-god damned stupidity and anti-wanting to see it go on for another 50 years.

What comes across as anti-Palestinian on the other hand, is generally bigotry and hatred of Muslims.

Of course there are some people who actually do hate Israel or are actually antisemitic , but it's far less than the number of people who speak out against the actions the Israeli government is currently taking.

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SirGarth posted:

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you clearly didn't bother to read about what the options are for fulfilling the service requirement, and what the alternatives/exceptions are.

and i think there is a huge moral difference between mandatory service to your country at 18, and teaching your children younger than 10 that there is no higher purpose in life than to blow yourself up for your country.

frankly, i'm surprised that's even debatable... but again, to each their own.

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Ptilk posted:

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I don't see any "moral" difference in encouraging children to look forward piloting gunships that bomb city centers and encouraging children to carry bombs into city centers. Both sides "reward" the families of the ones who die while carrying out such missions. Both sides honor their memory and make monuments to their "sacrifice".

The suicide aspect of course is pretty horrifying... but they don't have gunships.

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YouMightSeeMe posted:

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Pointless to argue with Garth. A jew would never admit to the evils of Israel.

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SirGarth posted:

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i think you're missing the point of the discussion... i know you hate Israel and all, but take a deep breath and try to focus.

simple question: do you think recruiting children to be suicide bombers and glorifying their deaths is morally equivalent to Israel's military service system?

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Orwyn_Blackheart posted:

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Where in Gods' name do you see him saying he hates Isreal?

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Azure-TheBlueOne posted:

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I don't understand why we support Israel so heavily. They don't seem to be much better than any other country/people in that sector of the world, and with our support, it seems like we're enabling them to be much worse tyrants as time goes on.

On a tangent, as a Christian nation, I really don't understand our heavy support and relation with Jews, yet nearly unmasked animosity for Muslims.

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ineenia posted:

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All that has to happen for the Palestinians to live in peace is to stop defending themselves from Israeli aggression.

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