I ask these questions for a reason:

There is a 3 faction pvp MMO being made (early stages) and a relic type mechanic may or not make it in, and PvP or Realm ranks and other Long term character goals may not be ready by release?

So, I ask the DAoC community, because I plan to submit the data. How important, to you, has the following been to the endgame and longevity of DAoC?:

Relic system?
Realm Ranks?
Realm abilities?
Titles and lifetime stat tracking?

<<<Please try to be helpful and back up your reason if you have the time. My pre-thanks to everyone that helps answer this.>>>

 

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Realm Ranks/RAs? Pretty crucial, as both RvR incentives and what I consider to be a core of the PvP experience in any game. Nobody PvPs for PvP's sake anymore. Gamers these days need to get something out of the experience.

Relics? Not crucial at all outside of large scale RvR incentives, which could have been introduced in much better and more subtle ways that don't involve a straight damage increase. I couldn't care less about them.

Titles and stat tracking? Only useful for bragging on forums and a mild sense of accomplishment. I honestly couldn't care less about these.

 

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i only play this game b/c of the RR/RA systems, i'm surprised no one else has emulated DAOC's PVP system... they all seem to jump on WoW's bandwagon which is way subpar.

Relics were awesome back in 2001-2005 when ppl had realm pride, i think the problem with xrealming due to lack of population for realm locked servers has taken away the meaningfulness of relics

if another medieval game was released with a very similar PVP setup as DAoC and good publicity to get subsciptions, i would be it's first applicant

 

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Good start. I appreciate the serious responses, and need and respect the input from daoc people, as I think it was the best pvp MMO I ever played. Silly me tried to make this thread on Ywain, and absolutely nothing is taken serious there. Thanks.

/continue

 

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Relic system?

i agree with what was said, that the straight damage increase perhaps wasn't the best idea to give someone. basically, if your zerg is big enough to take all the relics in the first place, its now defending those relics with 20% damage increase. so perhaps a 20% exp increase is enough for the pvers to want to pvp for something but not something that will simply make overpopulated that much stronger. or sometime along those lines.

Realm Ranks?

totally. once you reach max level, then what? pvp just to pvp ended when there was no penalty for dieing in pvp. even in UO, you would pvp for silver to get faction gear or just to loot someones body.

Realm abilities?

yes prob not the iwin buttons that we have come to learn and "love" in daoc, but a way to further develop your character outside of pve is something that i look for in mmos now.

Titles and lifetime stat tracking?

most if not all titles are just /timeplayed. unless you get a title for a live event or something like that, and that live event wont come around for a while, that i can understand.

 

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You are asking those who form a tiny niche of the overall MMO community (those who remain at DAoC are mostly RvR centric where the typical MMO player is PvE centric) to give their views and you think that the answers may improve some other game.


WarHammer was designed to attempt to cater to the tiny niche of PvP players. WarHammer has shown that it is not a very profitable idea to cater to the tiny niche. It is good to have the niche people in your game, but it is best to have the tiny niche surrounded by millions of general players rather than just having a few tens of thousand niche players.


While I understand the questions, and the answers can bring some interesting insight, I disagree with the paradigm the questions seem to be based on. . . . but I will still give answers.


Relic system?

A good idea. It helps give purpose to Realm Pride. The rewards need adjustment but the basic idea is good.


Realm Ranks?

Not a good idea but not terrible. RRs began the shift of focus toward selfish goals. Selfishness is inherent and already pervasive in the human condition, any promotion of selfishness can cause game problems that quickly grow out of control.


Realm Ranks that are built around helping your realm mates and/or built around accomplishing realm goals, would allow realm ranks to exist but would counter some of the natural selfishness that is typical of the human condition.


Realm abilities?

This was a huge nail in the coffin of Realm Pride and it dramatically contributes to the Min/Max challenge that gives, and has given, DAoC huge challenges.


I like RAs and I would guess that most players like them. Liking RAs does not change the damage RAs caused to DAoC.


In the old days it was Realm vs. Realm, it was a call to arms where players would suicide to get their characters to the frontiers and help defend the realm, but today it is “If you steal any of my RAs I will find out where you live irl and . . . .” Today many worship the RP/RA demon and care nothing for the realm they play in.


Titles and lifetime stat tracking?

Nothing wrong with this as long as the majority of the stats that are allowed to be tracked are not selfish stats that move players toward psychosis or move players against realm pride.


WoW allows players to track hundreds and hundreds (if not thousands) of stats. Some players are not driven by stats and others are. Those players who are driven by stats should have access to track them.


You left out something else that I bleieve is critical.

Something like a DF where PvE players have incentives to PvP a bit more so that they can gain access to great/fun PvE dungeon(s).

 

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Correct. I am asking because this game i am talking about, isn't even in beta yet, and feedback is openly accepted. My views are biased, like others, but if I could 'possibly' influence a game's direction toward my way of thinking, that I plan to speak NOW rather than NOT speak. If I can lobby for 1 positive, than I will feel that I maybe, made a positive impact. Secondly, the game is being made by a small start up studio that seems very open minded at this stage, and its target audience IS those niche pvp-centric players. Therefore, my questions, so I can use others feedback to help point out my argument to go more the DAoC-route in design, and less of the WAR, or Aion, or Rift type deigns. Thanks for your input. Hope I cleared up my motivation for the Q & A session.

 

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realm ranks - important. need some sense of accomplishment. realm abilities - weren't always in the game and could live without. relics - pretty important to rally the realm. Titles and stats - eliminate. Need people to play for their realm vs. padding stats.

Too bad because it will not do well if its focus is the PvP market. At its best, it will do as well as WarHammer (which still has not recouped its cost of development).


For any PvP game to have a good market share it needs to also have a good PvE game.


IMO if you took WoWs PvE, improve the graphics, keep the realm invasion system they have, add a third realm and add the DAoC frontiers. . . .that would give the best PvE AND the best PvP game in existence.


If the other game duplicates what DAoC has today, they will be duplicating the death that DAoC has today.

 

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