I think you two are talking apples and oranges here. Tiviee is talking about keeping up with the Joneses and Drakier is talking about getting levels without buffs. One being competetively and the other not. Playing without buffs is not only doaeble, it was a way of life for many before the higher levels were attained, not everyone could buff themselves. I mean pre-DM when level 50 was considered high level and level 126 characters were few. Only the mages had all the buffs and so they rocked. Then it was realized what a boon magic was, everyone re-rolled with 3-schoolers and buffed themselve. I played an archer to about 45 and made an Og mage to keep up too. But I could still play my archer and make pyreals and have a blast of a time, I just didn't level as fast as 3-school templates.


Pre-DM 3 school melees were rare to uncommon, afterward, the reverse was true. Now due to buffbots and rending weapons, either is viable.


migrax

<< The Pure Player is absolute bull fodder becuase those so called Pure players have used trophy items, picers, quest items like alloys and other items to hand in to gain levels, >>


What is a pure player? I don't see any issues with a "pure" player turning in items in thegame for XP, that is what those items are there for. A "pure" player is only suppose to level by killing things? News to many of us if so.


<< If there is a way to Play in TODAYS game from 5 to 100+ without buffs as a MELEE not mage >>


Now without buffs is different then without using a buffbot. Without buffs at all I would say it would be pretty darn hard unless you have a vassal that generates a lot of XP for you. Without using buffbots isn't that hard. I have a character that is level 131 and hasn't used buffbots.

 

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<<<< Peoples' misconceptions with UCMing are vast >>


It mainly seems to be the UCM'ers that come up with multiple definitions to fit their needs. Everyone else tends to stick with Turbine's definition:


Allowing your character to gain experience points by engaging in combat without being at the keyboard, ready to respond to an Administrator on demand (this activity is commonly called a "Combat Macro".

>>


The misconceptions I am referring to don't have to do with the definition of UCMing. They have to do with the details of UCMing. Such as, how complicated it is or isn't, what really goes on, how the programs work, what needs to be done in preparation, and how to stay one step ahead of the envoys.


For instance, a common misconception is that groups of macros are watched by someone in IRC and anyone tested will be controlled remotely through IRC. While this is partially true, it has been broken for about 3 years now. IRC remote control worked between the time they were developed after macroing was considered against the rules, and until the, then admins, caught on and merely asked different questions. Such as, remove your helm and put it back on, or they'll ask the player what color their robe is or something.


So what does that mean? For the past 3 years, any UCMer that was tested and passed was actually at the keyboard and responded. Whether through the use of alerts or active monitoring.


Now, there was work being done on a feature of LT that would provide comprehensive remote access capability, but from what I understand it was never completed. (If it was completed, it was never implemented. Even to those "paying" customers back when LT was private.)


I swear, there are still people today that think Que' and his buddies are still remotely macroing in Lacuna.

I would play pure if I had people to play pure with. But usually when someone "new" joins Dereth, the first person they find shows thems the buffbots, shows them the xp dungeons, and then its all down hill from there.


There are plenty of things to do for a person that would want to play the game pure. I bet probably the majority of new players in the last several years has no idea what a Lucky Gold Letter or a Scarlet Red Letter are.


What about a bandit weapon? My orginal character used 1 bandit yaoji for probably 50+ levels.


I'd love to have a new server that was decal free. Encrypted somehow to prevent any 3rd party interference. Not because Im anti-macro, but rather beause Im pro-playing.


Pro-playing has become a thing of the past. If you're not over 140, then you're sitting in an xp dungeon still probably. And I don't agree with that principle. Do I have to live with it? Yes. Do I live with it? Yes.


Would I like the ability to create a character tonight and go to a starter town and find another new character that would like to run around and kill level 5 drudges as we try to find the uberest loot off a level 9 mite? Sure! You know how difficult and fun it is to go against a pack of Banderling Ravers, Guards, and etc with just a few spells from the various loot gems you find on corpses?


I'd love the ability to find someone that hasn't started their character off with a rending weapon, a buffbot, and fully tinkered armor. But they don't exist. The player community's attitude has drastically changed the last 4+ years to where if you aren't a high level character, you ain't ....


Well If we eliminated buffbots, I think the world would be a much better place. Do I currently use them? Sure, I even use them with my level 171. Just so I can bane armor and buff weapons while the bot does my creatures/life spells. But In no way should a level 1 character be able to get level 7 spells on him. Perhaps if you can't cast a certain level spell yourself, a "boon" spell shouldn't be able to be cast on you.


Drakier is right, macroing destroyed the game. There are pros and cons to almost everything in this world and to totally disregard the cons to macroing...well you're just pulling the wool over your own eyes. This is why some things are against the CoC.

This is perfect example, my lvl 30 swordsman cannot touch an obsidian goleum lvl 51? without buffs. Even with lvl 7 buffs he gets hit decently. If I didn't have the horrible buff bots buff me what the hell could I hunt?


Maybe I could self buff lvl 3's?


So the gdam buff bots ruined this game that i cannot even play the game unless I had the buffs, cart before horse logic here. I think you gots forgot to bait your hook and are trying to catch the big one.


What can I hunt as lvl 30 and where if I can only buff self with 3's or 4's


Sure your lvl 155 doesn';t need buff bots LOL why speak the obvious.


Who cares if you dudn't need buff bots 5 years agao, it is not the same game as 5 years ago, you guys are stuck in the mud - Evolve a little bit like the game does.


Maybe you don't like the new coolants for airconditioners in cars and want to go back to freon???? or horse and buggy is even better.

"lvl 30 swordsman cannot touch an obsidian goleum lvl 51"


do you not see something wrong with that equation?


a level 30 SHOULDN'T be able to touch a level 51.


in MOST games, you can barely touch things that are 10 levels above you.. let alone 21 levels above. That's suicide in most games.

Pretty much what drakier said, Tiviee.


I remember when I use to go to, i believe, a dungeon called Nexus. It had obsidian golems at the bottom that I would harvest for hearts and make obsidian keys. Then I'd sell them so people could open the msyneumes that zombies drop.


Anyways, like I said above, all I had on my sword guy until he was around level 60 or 70ish was a slash bandit yaoji. Double strike. It would take me awhile to kill things and since he was a stupid swordsman, he died alot. He has a little less than 1000 deaths.


Sure, I got pissed off on alot of those deaths. Who doesn't? But I think those people that have 2 or 3 deaths, that have born on dates of less than a year AND are higher level than my 171 main character....have missed out on alot of challenge.


That's what's lacking in the game. With the buffbots, acm plugins, auto-looters, all the portals Turbine's added in the last few years, and etc......the game has been diminished to being bored. Some of you call leveling tedious....ok...some of you call buffing tedious...ok...some of you call finding items, trophies, and etc tedious..ok....some of you call kill quests tedious..ok...some of you call questing in general tedious..ok......what's left? Chatting with your friends? You can do that on IRC with the ucmers. lol


I dunno, guess I miss the whole point in semi-playing the game. I've only ever used 3 or 4 plugins. Sixth Sense and then Bandit Sight....so i could find dye plants and my corpses. Oracle of dereth which helped me find how to get to places.....treestats/acstats...and the various tradebot plugins over the years.


It was pretty sickening, to me, to be in a fellowship hunting the Dires or somewhere similiar and someone suddenly run off from the pack to pick up a dye plant....well crap...I better download that plugin so I don't get screwed out of finding things.


Treestats and acstats I used many years ago because back before macro hunting became so robust...I was actually close to the top of some of the categories....well that changed as soon as Eltank and etc became so widespread. Gone were the days of a normal everyday player being tops in anything. You had to watch Oprah while you played AC to have the highest skills in the game. *puke*


But anyways, back to the orginal topic.......I find it very discouraging that people make admin alarms. I sometimes question whether the decal developers give a ...., because lets be honest, they sure don't give the appearance of caring. With all that brainpower, they could of blocked certain things a long time ago.

There's drudge lurkers...that';s what I leveled off of almost exclusively...the various levels of drudges in the game.


It's not some one else's fault you don't know how to play lol

 

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Lurcher: believe me... we care..


but unfortunately it isn't nearly as easy as you make it sound.


the number 1 rule to security is that it takes the hackers LONGER to hack out the security and protections than it takes you to put them in. If they can break it in less time, then it wasn't time well spent.


We have yet to have been given any ideas that are feasible to the point of implementation. We've had our fair share of ideas, and some people have donated ideas on what to fix in that department. We've made our attempts at some of them, and others just aren't really possible under the current conditions. Ultimately it is up to Turbine to make the final say. Technically, Admin Alarms in and of themselves are not against the CoC. However, I know from personal experience that it IS against their wishes.. just not legally.


So until Turbine comes out and flat out BANS the usage of Admin Alarms, there isn't a whole lot that can be done about it. Turbine needs to take the initiative and effort and put a clause in the CoC banning them. They also need to take the initiative to do some more permanent damage in the way of breaking all Admin Alarms. We're doing our part as we can. Unfortunately, we don't have infinite resources, nor are most of the suggestions really possible.


That being said.. we care, and we're trying.

^Thanks Big D.