so what happened with the lifetank ppl and their secret access to admin detection, that immortalbob and all the other ppl had access to?

 

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Drakier, man, you need to open your eyes.


Here, I'll late it out on the table for you.





GET IT YET?


ROFL WTB: 1 CLUE FOR DRAKIER.

 

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btw looks good, should pm I linkage

 

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btw looks good, should pm I linkage


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me 2!

 

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-Eps... you still don't get it.


I am NOT discussing WarBot, LifeTank, ELTank, or any other plugin in THIS thread. THIS thread is about your "Macro Assist" plugin.


I don't care what WarBot, LifeTank, ELTank, or any of those other plugins do in relation to this thread. We're talking about what YOUR plugin does. If you want to create a WarBot thread and have me comment on that, I'll be more than happy to. This is not the appropriate thread for WarBot conversation however.


This thread is about your plugin, and therefore, that is what we are discussing. You can sit there and cry "But the other plugins are doing it" all you want. Doesn't change the fact that YOUR plugin is doing it, and since we are discussing YOUR plugin, then I'm telling you isn't right. Just as I've told the developers of LifeTank, ELTank, and WarBot (in their own threads).


All you're trying to do is shift blame off yourself, and cause a distraction for people. It's a "straw man" argument. Every time I discuss your plugin, you bring up LifeTank, or WarBot and try to make claims that "they do it too". You can't use them as a shield in this thread about YOUR plugin.


Furthermore, you haven't actually ADDRESSED any of my concerns about what your plugin does other than to say "WarBot does it" or "LifeTank does it". Just because they do it, or have done it, doesn't make it right. You can't use that as an excuse to shoot someone. "Snoop Dogg did it!" yeah... right.

Perhaps it doesn't make things "right" but it certainly doesn't make this program "any worse" than the others. Considering the fact that they are not restricted by the Decal Devs and cover all the same possibilities as this program covers, there is no logical reason to restrict this program given the precedent.


Personally, I could care less, but I think the point still stands.

 

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its basically an edited warbot without the macro features and ect... and without 50 billion tabs you have to click through


am I right?

 

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I do not see what all fuss is over allowing EPS to post, discuss and sdvertise his plugin. Its purpose is UCM.


As previously stated there are a number of UCM programs around. Paraduck a VN producer works on one as does a VN moderator Crelic (Lifetank). The authors are allowed to advertise, discuss, etc. Since Lifetank is approved by the Vault Network, I do not see what the problem is here.


The vault position has been, we are weakly against UCM. You can not recommend UCM. You can not explain how to do it. You can not suggest to use these program to UCM. Anything else is fine.


Basically all the Vault does is:

1) state UCM is against Turbines rules

2) You can not openly write about it

3) It is Turbine's job to enforce the TOS, COC, EULA not us


Even Turbine isn't against these programs because Turbine refuses to make a public statement. The only restriction Turbine has the user is not allowed to UCM. Turbine only enforcement is to ban a user if they catch them. These days this is not very often.


The whole UCM issue reminds me of fireworks in many states. It is illegal for people to set them off. However, it legal to sell, advertise, transport and possese fireworks. The police, etc can not do anything to you unless they catch you in the act of using them. People know this so the threat of ban is much of a deterrant.


I understand your point Drakier about responsibility. About not providing tools to users to break rules.


If I recall correctly you were or currently part of the Decxl development. This make you no more clean than EPS, Paraduck and Crellic. According your writing you feel very strongly against UCM. Yet you provide tools to facilate UCM - just like EPS, Paraduck and Crelllic.


Your actions at best are UCM neutral. At worst UCM supporting. It is just that your writing not in alignment with what you do.


If you felt this strongly about the issue. Why did you not resign from Decal Development when they refused to fight back on morale grounds? This is what morally responsibile people do in real life when faced with this situaion. Why do you continue to help and support UCM?


Sorry about the rant and raving here. I just find it strange, hilarous and funny - looking on from the outside. Seeing three kettles calling the pot (EPS) blacker than their shade of black.

We as Decal Developers HAVE attempted to remove UCM. Unfortunately, it is not as simple as just turning it off.


We've spent countless months debating ways we can make Decal less likely to be abused through UCM without probihiting play for "normal" users. Unfortunately, we have not been able to come up with anything, and we haven't received any user suggestions that are feasible.


While you can sit there in your chair all you want calling us hypocrits or saying "pot meet kettle" it's a completely different situation. Decal is a plugin framework developed for plugins. We have a Code of Ethics which is about as strong as your parents telling you "No". People who have no respect for their parents pay no attention to that, just as people who have no respect for Decal or the Decal Developers completely ignore the Code of Ethics. It is unenforceable.


That said, We HAVE made changes to Decal in the past to prohibit, deter, and even stop people from being able to UCM. Do you remember what happened then? Elgar released a new Decal, and/or a modified "CastSpell" dll that he included into his projects that unlocked Decal for Casting war spells.


You should know just as well as other developers that the key to security is it taking the hackers LONGER to break your "security" than it takes to implement. If you spend more time designing and implementing a security system than it takes for a hacker to break it, then it was pretty much a completely wasted effort.


Decal is and has always been a plugin framework that interfaces with Asheron's Call to extend play. To that extent, there is only so much we can control without prohibiting perfectly reasonable play, or asking for trouble with hackers.


And don't even attempt to lump me in with ANYONE who has written a UCM or a UCM Aide. I did not create Decal. I maintain it so that I have a say in what goes on. I do so for the purpose to have a voice that actually is able to do something provided there is something to do. I do NOT purposely go out of my way to create tools to aide in breaking the CoC or to do anything that goes against the Code of Ethics. To say I do is completely wrong and I take great offense to being lumped in with them.

hey look, somebody finally guessed it right!

 

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